0:00:10okay so the average age was about nineteen years old we had people who are
0:00:17as young as nine
0:00:19and as old as i was which was
0:00:22twenty seven or twenty six
0:00:25so pretty young
0:00:28and you know you don't think like well for some people so i would be
0:00:33know about formal software development right
0:00:36they're just they were they were pretty much we need
0:00:41and that would be important later
0:00:44we had cooled things like swallowed laps
0:00:48in those days we used to be able to take any X program and just
0:00:53swallowed in to be the panel so we had all cries of interesting stuff
0:00:59but really fit all these things all these features and options and so forth it
0:01:05really was
0:01:07on sustain
0:01:09you know and we had
0:01:11we had there was a big male that's was pretty famous and gonna buy havoc
0:01:16pennington there's basically it says we can't keep doing this
0:01:22and we have to improve
0:01:25and one thing i heard about right is that just was are rated ready to
0:01:31drop us
0:01:32you know
0:01:33and i say this is like because we're gonna go about why do we go
0:01:37from one point a to point there's a lot of reasons why people to widen
0:01:41we just keep doing what we were doing
0:01:44so we were talking about two point
0:01:48we were transitioning from
0:01:52and immature board group of
0:01:55boys and young men
0:01:59something more formal right we were growing up as a project going on was growing
0:02:04a we have to care about A P I N B I stability
0:02:08we have to
0:02:11worry about these things because application developers are saying well i can depend on this
0:02:17it we can do any of this stuff because you keep changing things
0:02:23we really had to get serious and
0:02:27do something
0:02:31i say that because today than i was a very conservative project right we don't
0:02:36we don't allow for a patch as get extreme
0:02:42so it's not easy to get in and being able to do something
0:02:48so i this is sort of the background where we can
0:02:53when we will to can own to there was a lot of also
0:02:57i mean you know people are change
0:03:00they just
0:03:02the like and like there be like what did you do this why do but
0:03:05you remove this feature what did you do that right and
0:03:10and the thing is that
0:03:15what do we knew about can really average back
0:03:18what did been
0:03:20again tickets consider a range right
0:03:24free software was probably young you know and
0:03:28we left
0:03:31we like a lot of
0:03:32things onset we had allowed are can you need to write our story for us
0:03:40so when people you when you see these gold thread still say you see a
0:03:44common theme complaints from people you know what
0:03:50such as like every month points was like
0:03:54we didn't we didn't and it wouldn't explain to them
0:03:58why we change use X
0:04:00we managed you can tell the context
0:04:03we don't really give them anything to really
0:04:06hold on to so
0:04:08we allow people to write our story for us and we just went on you
0:04:15whole bunch of complaints and you know it didn't matter that was free software back
0:04:20that we all that everybody was yell that it was a bizarre model right that's
0:04:25what you're doing
0:04:29question is if you look back we said could we have done better
0:04:37i don't know i don't know the answer for that i don't think we could
0:04:40have done better
0:04:42like i said a three to is relatively unheard
0:04:45for that all that thank you many management
0:04:48we don't really do that
0:04:50and so
0:04:53we just sort of let it pass and
0:04:56do whatever you need to do
0:04:59but then
0:05:01after ten years of development
0:05:04brno three came along
0:05:07and it was a different well
0:05:10but when we plan this really is
0:05:12we spend an enormous amount of time and this is
0:05:15we had videos we had great release notes i mean we never did a that
0:05:21you know to i mean we never had the kind of release notes were doing
0:05:25today arguably was by one of the best plan releases we did not want
0:05:31what happened at we don't want that
0:05:34four point thing but
0:05:37i knew i knew that it was gonna be
0:05:43hard just based on what happened what one or two point
0:05:47because we really did change a lot of things right
0:05:53for me personally i didn't want anybody to write our story
0:05:59i didn't
0:06:01we needed to be ready
0:06:04when the onslaught occur
0:06:10initial reactions
0:06:12was not exactly what
0:06:15wasn't was less than spectacular right i mean i think we could summon up to
0:06:26the unholy mess that is be known three
0:06:31which was done by
0:06:34we used for about
0:06:41can we really blame that right
0:06:44we change me change interactions completely
0:06:48we the interface is change completely we do niemann
0:06:55there's nothing there was no bridge between be known to dig around three
0:07:00how did one
0:07:03go from one to the other especially if you've spent ten years on a our
0:07:08work flow
0:07:10and suddenly you want to this so it's not it's not always
0:07:16it was not going to be so that
0:07:18just because people had invested so much time on this on the desktop
0:07:28there was a lot of outrage
0:07:31i mean a lot of outrage
0:07:34and we had a probably must
0:07:44that's it can see
0:07:49it's a different world out there right now trying to gonna two days you have
0:07:54social wouldn't have to face but we didn't have
0:07:57a whole any we have a lot we have footer whitman have a lot of
0:08:06things can go bad news travels fast
0:08:10bad news travels faster
0:08:12ugly news travels even faster than that
0:08:15so social really increases proliferation
0:08:19and then you get you get this bad news you know this is the last
0:08:26one that i meander you heard that joke many times
0:08:29or maybe were staring into the abyss
0:08:32there is there is
0:08:34the there's all the stuff and then you know the news media picks it up
0:08:37and it just goes on and on a not and the whole point is
0:08:42how do you control all those you know and how do you control and make
0:08:47sure that
0:08:49we're always maintaining are best face forward
0:08:54so i which is required a pretty they have these for damage control
0:08:58and trying to make sure we change the conversation
0:09:08so that's really the importance of engaging
0:09:13it's important and greater kidder critics
0:09:16explain our motivations
0:09:19and the design and
0:09:23when we engage
0:09:25barbora communicating are intact right
0:09:28we're saying this is why we're doing something
0:09:32if somebody complains about the lack of feature or real terminal is solely not without
0:09:37transfers you dear god why
0:09:41it's not it's because
0:09:44the specific reasons
0:09:46and you know a lot some of that is because of not enough resources whatever
0:09:51it is but if we don't challenge that then we fall into the same thing
0:09:57right we're always talking about remove feature well we don't or remove transparency see they're
0:10:02doing it again
0:10:03and you have to be
0:10:05always out there and
0:10:08when you do
0:10:12when you do go out there and you challenge your critics
0:10:16they will see grouchy
0:10:19i have turned i had done is many times somebody anybody on the internet can
0:10:23sit there and
0:10:25saves whatever battle there
0:10:27if you come up there and you tell them that's not sure
0:10:32i work are gonna
0:10:34that's not true and they will back down
0:10:37it has happened many times be conversation changes
0:10:43and when the conversation changes you control the conversation you control the conversation and you
0:10:48change the conversation
0:10:51and that is one of the great benefits of engagement
0:10:57because we are able to do
0:10:59that kind of thing it's actually quite rewarding when you can change minds
0:11:09is when you shouldn't do
0:11:10don't engage don't sit around or stick your head in the same
0:11:15you don't you don't wanna do that
0:11:18because if you don't but something else writes it your story for you again it's
0:11:23all about writing the story you don't wanna tell let somebody else saying this is
0:11:28what can and stands for
0:11:30this is what they do we don't want that all
0:11:34so don't stick your hands and don't
0:11:39don't disengage
0:11:41you know when three pornos come out there was no developers out there now there's
0:11:47a lot of the reasons for that and that was and they had just finished
0:11:50report out there trying to stabilisation but there was no apparatus
0:11:57hold all those creepy
0:11:59critiquing are criticising right
0:12:04we had
0:12:07we have to do a lot of a lot of engagement i mean there and
0:12:11there is our apparatus we have lots of high profile people yet used or about
0:12:16that in the one are you have all these people who have this year to
0:12:21the media complaining
0:12:26we didn't really explain ourselves today
0:12:33engage and
0:12:35was slow
0:12:37we start off very slow
0:12:41we didn't we didn't have any mechanism to
0:12:45talk about engagement in a tackle but we didn't have any mechanism to
0:12:53show what we're doing right we had we had really snows we had all those
0:12:56great stuff about how cool everything was
0:13:01we didn't say why
0:13:04why don't we do this
0:13:05we didn't wouldn't do any that's that
0:13:09and when usa what was the what was the reason why we had
0:13:14you know hotspots or things like that what was the reason for all
0:13:19so where was where was the explanation
0:13:21for that
0:13:22and so
0:13:25that's where
0:13:28things goes wrong right and
0:13:32and you don't and you lose track of the conversation
0:13:37so which really was time to get
0:13:40serious right
0:13:43we need to pull together
0:13:45our communication channels and
0:13:48really engage the community right so we did a number things we created the facebook
0:13:54profile we created a tutor account we did a google plus
0:14:00we did everything we could to make sure that we can control the message
0:14:05we consolidated begin on name space on I R C we controlled entire signal space
0:14:12nobody can create a good on channel without are say so
0:14:19you know
0:14:20i took on a lot
0:14:22kernel developers picks like that
0:14:25just happened my bad like that
0:14:28i'd being game being employed that open source technology centre i also have to have
0:14:34i also have a lock from developers and X developers and approach stick so you
0:14:40why will go plus pages probably filled with flames
0:14:45but you know
0:14:47and i took it even further i actually searched
0:14:51eighteen we have tag you know
0:14:54engage them even i didn't did pass so i wasn't possible and that's all i
0:14:59was impressed i went through and i found anybody i can any wild eyed person
0:15:04on the internet i mean you know because it was worth it i went to
0:15:11like read it and i would to read slashdot whatever it was
0:15:16and you know i put myself out there because i need to make sure that
0:15:24we we're putting are best face forward and we are communicating
0:15:35how the how that there
0:15:42i guess people to order based
0:15:45but the google plus can is been pretty good
0:15:48and even on L W N same thing
0:15:52it can be really rewarding and you can change minds
0:15:56and you and if even that they're not you know they're upset with you know
0:16:01whatever it is
0:16:03you have built a reputation for yourself
0:16:08so your own personal reputation goes up
0:16:12and people will look at user trustworthy resource
0:16:17for anything related to good know or just as a person
0:16:28and so and on the other the other common want to make was that you
0:16:32know at this point
0:16:35it's just a self sustaining
0:16:37so we could have a bad news day
0:16:40and we could see comments where we will actually see people say that why like
0:16:47about three what's wrong with it so
0:16:50before we didn't have any way in like in ago today's happy to these people
0:16:57saying at it was silence now i have people's challenging
0:17:03well i'm the people i i'm not you're doing that other people are doing that
0:17:08and you know
0:17:09it's great and we have forums now we have that we will plus pages are
0:17:17have been on developers who are ford a rubber so going out there has been
0:17:21questions even writing extensions sample extensions things like that is all huge positive things and
0:17:29i think i think
0:17:31despite whatever who are articles you see on planet or whatever it is you know
0:17:39we're turning the corner this
0:17:42you know returning the corner
0:17:48so the question is
0:17:50is our job
0:17:55that's an interesting question
0:17:57and i'm gonna say no i think not by a long shot we have a
0:18:02lot of work to go into because it's a sustaining model continue moderate you're always
0:18:08gonna have to do that because always gonna be amiss some misconception or something
0:18:15so it's really important we continue to engage your own community our that our committee
0:18:21what can be found out from disaster the posters that we also they need to
0:18:26do outreach to our internally right
0:18:29there are a lot of people who are maybe not sure about where we're going
0:18:32or what for doing and we should really
0:18:36have our conversation within ourselves
0:18:39so that we don't have posted talks about
0:18:42the last one a core
0:18:45this or any other thing where people are not sure we should read if we
0:18:50they should come to us and that's a that's a role that really managers to
0:18:54be able to have someone to go to
0:18:58to talk about doubts
0:19:01instead of taking into the airways
0:19:04right so
0:19:07so we need to that's something we need to work we need to be able
0:19:12to do community involvement internal
0:19:20so drinking we might
0:19:24i guess the number
0:19:27different case you know a lot of people don't do what i do which is
0:19:31will and engage people aggressively and
0:19:36finding fights and here is probably are used a stipulate and good i was
0:19:43well the thing to do is sort of a way to pass time and now
0:19:47we have a bit of scotch
0:19:50and whatnot
0:19:53good times right good times so
0:19:59but they're gonna do it right there that there's something is or if you're an
0:20:04introvert you probably the support not something free
0:20:08and if you're sensitive or you lose your temper a lot usually lose bought another
0:20:14thing for you
0:20:16you're a measure requires patience
0:20:19and i mean a lot of patience
0:20:21it also requires repeating yourself
0:20:25you can have the you can have an argument you can repeat the same thing
0:20:28over there is always something really interesting about that
0:20:33because if you say it and you say in the soothing voice
0:20:37they actually do
0:20:39stop complaining
0:20:42and they back up and sort of like okay
0:20:48and they will try what you tried everything like green exit
0:20:53the same thing
0:20:55create a i think i have actually is that so
0:21:02but the other thing is obviously part
0:21:05no matter how ugly yes
0:21:08be possible and you'll get to say that the previous screen i showed but people
0:21:13say the argument compliments is precisely that if you're keeping a positive it or track
0:21:20the other person you actually get results
0:21:27so a couple times be sincere
0:21:33in the and i know that some you know you need to be across a
0:21:37cheerleader it something socks and you agree you say
0:21:41i agree it sucks
0:21:43people will believe you're always going to be defensive
0:21:51so it's a if you don't this if you agree i agree you're right it's
0:21:56something we need to work on
0:21:58let me let me get back
0:22:02it was about patience
0:22:04D free software person
0:22:08it's very emotional based
0:22:10they are
0:22:13passion is a double edge sword
0:22:18the passion that drives people to write code
0:22:21also dies and to be email
0:22:24and it is it is that it's a fight a because they will blabber about
0:22:32think so again
0:22:34you gotta you gotta keep saying this is what we do it this is how
0:22:38we doing this is why we doing you gotta have to repeat yourself and
0:22:45i'm kind of repeating myself here and there but
0:22:49you do need to keep positive and it is gonna be worthwhile
0:22:54the other important point is
0:22:57and this is something to learn from marketing i used when i was in college
0:23:01i was actually part of a marketing
0:23:03college group and we were selling
0:23:06that we have the me stuff that we were
0:23:10i providing
0:23:12i opportunity companies to get interns from other countries
0:23:17and what things
0:23:19i think that there's some training when things you go through is that we're marketing
0:23:24somebody you need to get something
0:23:28anything head paper phone number
0:23:34so i'm applying that principle to complainers
0:23:38it somebody complains something i can why we're doing this way so the file but
0:23:44help the bottle but do it can to get
0:23:48then to invest
0:23:49and the project some way some shape where for
0:23:52i did i did this to kernel develop this
0:23:57they start complaining and actually file but it's very easy to complain but if you
0:24:02can get them to actually file and do something
0:24:05big way
0:24:07big way
0:24:11be could definitely in we want to do that we wanna turn complacent to
0:24:16in to do is if they don't like the direction of the project
0:24:21get an ball jointed a foundation
0:24:24do something
0:24:25because only then you're gonna have a voice if you have a voice then you
0:24:29have a way to change
0:24:33that's how i've always approach people who complain is that
0:24:38well you can't you can't complain
0:24:42and then not invest time
0:24:45that you don't get anything for free
0:24:50so in the end it's a mixed bag
0:24:54where they change their minds are not at least to remember you
0:25:04really when you remember you then you can always restart the conversation elation because
0:25:09nothing stays the same
0:25:11the same thing happened one point you were many people that were stripe stabilised
0:25:18people come back
0:25:20so our works
0:25:22everything nothing a static when people say i'm done jumper just one to katie
0:25:27there we like there will be
0:25:30katie will do something like come back
0:25:33sorry does like the idea tell you that
0:25:38the free stuff or animals or emotional first
0:25:43couple yes
0:25:46i want people to go out there and then
0:25:50do can really measure it and then speaker to go foundation
0:25:56you don't
0:25:57really people or experience are people who kindled
0:26:01be part of the project
0:26:04because you are at that point representing you know
0:26:07and it would be
0:26:11if you had somebody who's done this before and you know you don't actually put
0:26:17your foot in your mouth
0:26:22so if you're into a problem we should contact me or somewhere else on the
0:26:27marketing team
0:26:31go out there engage
0:26:33so this is pretty much a lot had for my top
0:26:37i can have some questions
0:26:49hi and it's not exactly question is mom like it can into just about complete
0:26:56to say now i would like to say that i think that is important to
0:27:01talk about complaints about them the fact that sometimes do something that is not very
0:27:07clear a how do you see how you say sorry i think that is very
0:27:15important to try to communicate to where we're going and the and the and try
0:27:20to and to make the in the people to be trust to trust a while
0:27:28the developer as a doing a for example have them this conversation on some years
0:27:33ago one and don't really in a already written believe that just read the do
0:27:40that and some people to all about this now is doesn't work of them to
0:27:45was that the number but not a to say okay and you had some questions
0:27:51to ask and so when people come from normal to me what can you i
0:27:57write for this and for that the from this one a please the passion readjusting
0:28:02the beginning so know be passion i ask in the don't ask sorry and the
0:28:08weight that the developer make their work so i think that's very important am trying
0:28:13to make the people understand that not everything would be done immediately so to have
0:28:20trust in the community and this is this is good
0:28:32that for the first or we will cover about our approach
0:28:37those exactly what part is to be brushed for i think a lot there are
0:28:44saying here is precisely that is
0:28:49that's where the carriers as is don't put your for
0:28:53right you're talking because
0:28:55what's your hope you know you should be fresh
0:28:59because you're older our reputation
0:29:02in your as
0:29:03so people will judge you that
0:29:09when developers communicate you know i've seen i've seen things that make me cringe so
0:29:17there was no you'll see you'll see you know developers going out of it kernel
0:29:22developers and it's like my god okay and for them it's just like what in
0:29:29was in the going to days it's just this bright they and i
0:29:37i don't try i mean i jabbed and then just try to keep it simple
0:29:43but it's not always
0:29:45possible right this is the same kind of thing with the okay M L and
0:29:50all that it's just it's just so something but the extra but i don't really
0:29:55like i guess grows probably are just and going out of that's just really
0:30:01not the way to behave at least certainly not for our side
0:30:09the questions
0:30:13right next regarding right i know